|
|
Post by Angel One on Dec 11, 2003 20:15:30 GMT
Couldnt think of a better title than that...  What if... There was no choices, only outcomes? If there was no free will, only destiny? There is an infinite number of choices available to you at any time right? You could reply to this, you could not, you could go outside now, you could watch tv. Thousands of millions of things could happen to you, someone could ocme into your room, they may not, you may get a phonecall, you may not. What if these things all occur? What if every possible choice you *could* conceivably make, has already been made, only in a different dimension/timeline/plane and by a different version of yourself? Meaning there are an infinite number of these timelines, where not only the choices you make, but the choices others have made, are *all* played out. Now what if choice was an illusion? If I am asked to paint a door, and I have some red paint, and some green paint, I can choose what colour to paint it right? Red or green? So I choose red, and the other version of myself chooses green. (There are also billions of other options, like not painting it, mixing the colours, etc etc etc) But what If I didnt get the choice to choose Red? What if I was destined to choose red, and the other version of myself was destined from the day he incarnated to choose to paint that door green? What if you cannot escape from destiny? What if every choice you make, every option you take, is the one you have been predetermined to take? Scary thought... What do you guys think? |
|
Silver Incubus
Member
All I own are ideas. I am the richest person alive.
Posts: 85
|
Post by Silver Incubus on Dec 11, 2003 21:56:49 GMT
I think that it is very possible.
From my experiences in life, every moment has lead to where I am now, and where I am now will lead to what will be.
If you want I can bore you with specific examples but ask me.
|
|
|
|
Post by Angel One on Dec 11, 2003 22:58:31 GMT
Yes bore me! Bore me! I mean... em... There isnt a polite answer to that is there?  |
|
Izkata
Member
T-I-dubble 'guh' errr
Posts: 164
|
Post by Izkata on Dec 12, 2003 3:22:36 GMT
Freaky - "Your future awaits you no matter what you do."
A commercial for the movie Paycheck played in my TV just after I clicked "reply" - and that qoute is it it.
Anyways, 2 reason I replied:
1. Better title(note the better spelling): "What is existence?"
2. I was thinking, if we could see the existence of two universes, and guaruntee that they are perfectly equal down to a molecular level, let them advance(perfectly the same) until they are about where we(in RL) are. Then release them into choice. Will they continue to make the same choices?
|
|
Silver Incubus
Member
All I own are ideas. I am the richest person alive.
Posts: 85
|
Post by Silver Incubus on Dec 22, 2003 18:35:07 GMT
OK now I have the time to finish this.
Ok like I was saying, especially using techniques i learned from the celestine prophecy I have gained true insight on the flow of things.
It's really hard to find a very first thing to comment so I will just do my past girlfriends as examples and how everything has lead to this day.
My first girlfriend like me in a time in which i had convinced myself that I was very ugly because I had not had a girlfriend, or ever really had a girl even talk with me about anything. So at this stage in my life, I was the anarchist, and in a rock band. I was very non social, and had but a handful of friends. My girlfriend of the time would actully tell me things that I did that were bad and subconcious(cuz she could be bitchy). Things like Always having to be right, always needing to win, the last word. So in general, a very ego driven self. I loved her a lot because she was my first so when we broke up, it was very hectic for me. But I started reading online boards like the original AS message board around that time, because I was becoming introspective. And I had also become much more socialable.
THen there was the time that I really started focusing on the spiritual aspect of things. I started getting into the metaphysical, and meditating, trying to ap etc.
A couple of months later I was playing in a battle of the bands and afterwards was in a slip off the road from a patch of ice while my bassist was chasing this car of people we thought were punks. My second girlfriend was in that car. We met but it was a long distance relationship and we really didn't have a whole lot in common. I became even more spiritual around this time, because I didn't have the girlfriend to hang around. So I eventually became close to another girl who really like me and my music, and so I broke up with the current one of the time to go out with the new one(a red head[which is my fave!]). Those first two relationships and everything else metaphysical had brought me to a new understanding of a realtionship.
At this time, I was more in control to who I was. And I also read the Celestine Prophecy. She could see ghost, and saw was even haunted by them. She could not sleep in silence because she would be able to hear them and since I was into the metaphysics I was completly understanding. I only loved in this relationship, and there was no arguing no jelousy, and complete trust by me, which was pretty unerving for her because she couldn't understand how I could be that way. But I had known that all those negative things will lead to more negative things later. Her mother was also into spirituality and she had a psychic friend who was really cool. She could talk to spirits and all that stuff, and she was give my GF at that time advice on how to deal with those spirits, by possibly asking them what they want.
The most important thing I learned from all of my girlfriends was that although I had become good friends with them, we didn't have that as a base for the relationship, and ultimately we had different goals and Ideas in my life and each of them helped my see what it was I was looking for. and that was
A girl with red hair.
A girl that liked heavy music
A girl that had a similar sense of humour
A girl that liked sex like I did
A girl that was ground and true to herself
A girl that was interested in metaphysics
And then I found Claire, whom im with now, and she is all that and more.
Because my first gf got me a job where I first met claire, it seems that it was just another part in the flow.
Oh and I have never really had to look for a job
they just seem to present themselves to me.
|
|
|
|
Post by Vaisnava on Dec 24, 2003 18:20:02 GMT
choices, outcomes
free will, destiny
these seemingly opposing truths actually co-exist.
Existence is without cessation, without change.
|
|
Silver Incubus
Member
All I own are ideas. I am the richest person alive.
Posts: 85
|
Post by Silver Incubus on Dec 24, 2003 20:01:55 GMT
Actually they don't both exist.
Free will to do what you want is only an illusion. I proved that in my story. I wasn't aware what I was doing but it still happened, it was still leading me there, its the fact that I soon learned from it that was the only bit of free choice I have
The only choice is whether or not you see the path or not,
|
|
|
|
Post by Vaisnava on Dec 24, 2003 20:08:13 GMT
Actually they don't both exist. Free will to do what you want is only an illusion. I proved that in my story. I wasn't aware what I was doing but it still happened, it was still leading me there, its the fact that I soon learned from it that was the only bit of free choice I have The only choice is whether or not you see the path or not, Well, a lot of people, upon hearing that free will is illusion, foolishly think "why does it matter that I do anything". And so they falsely cease to act, thinking that this is the way to be... On our level of consciousness we do not know the results of our choices. We have to accept that we do not know and thus make choices... Although, to The Absolute, the choices are known... us making them is part of the Divine Plan... We are inclined to accept that we domake choices on a relative level. This is what I mean by them co-existing. Relative and Absolute!!! |
|
|
|
Post by Angel One on Dec 24, 2003 20:40:09 GMT
Scary thought isnt it? That every choice we make could e predestined? Does that mean then that we are not responsible for the conequences of our choices? If we dont know the results, can we be held accountable for them? |
|
|
|
Post by Vaisnava on Dec 25, 2003 7:36:48 GMT
Does that mean then that we are not responsible for the conequences of our choices? If we dont know the results, can we be held accountable for them? No, we are responsible. We can't understand all the ripples created from dropping the stone in the lake, but we can get a general idea the nature of our actions. Regardless of whether the action is in the mode of goodness, passion or ignorance, there will be karma to endure. We simply cannot know how our actions affect everything. Nor do we really know what choices we shall make, until we have made them. On a relative level, we must act according to what we feel is best at the time. To write it off as illusion is pointless. One will still act according to how one sees fit. The fact that we make choices is not illusion. The illusion comes in thinking that we are independent creatures. |
|
|
|
Post by Angel One on Dec 25, 2003 12:42:18 GMT
Ah, very interesting.  I especially like that line I feel that we thats all we can do really. Depending on the situation, we will make different choices, it all depends. |
|
Silver Incubus
Member
All I own are ideas. I am the richest person alive.
Posts: 85
|
Post by Silver Incubus on Jan 2, 2004 13:46:50 GMT
Yeah, sorry, that is what i mean by free choice is an illusion. Although it is an illusion, we need that illusion to make those choices to see the path. I mean this whole life, in a way, is an illusion, but does that mean we are going to die, no. The illusion of free choice is just as important as everything else and is part of destiny. The consequences of your actions can be seen from the free choice point of view, but factors in your life have lead you to make that certain choice for a certain reason. The Tenth Insight talks about something similar to this, about the intended path you soul chooses before you incarnate, and the general path you have, but ultimate it is your mindfulness and being the path that gets you to where you should be.
|
|
