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Post by Sniper on Feb 14, 2004 19:58:54 GMT
Indeed you are blind... however I've seen such blind before...
I am here because I decided to join.
How do you interpret it?
Just a tool? Why so?
A tool for what?
I can blame a baby for not knowing right from wrong, but will I do that? The question is in the choice we make, there is always and there should always be a choice. That is a question of choice, not an ability.
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Post by Marquis on Feb 15, 2004 1:35:57 GMT
I say killing is wrong, and hate is a wrong view, crowley and I walk different path. Love is limited, compassion is true, many people have wrong view of love, they only love someone when they act or believe what they want to believe or act how they wish others to behave. That is not a true love, because that love is based on conditions. Compassion is moderate and more fitting for buddhism because buddha preached middle way, moderate view, neither extreme in both hate or love. I say love is limited because I have read many of crowleys work, and he preaches love or ultimate love, but what is his definition of it? Hmm, why do I not quote hitler and compalain when others complain by saying you are making a judment therefore you are being blind or against yoru beliefs. I have no problem sayign hitler had wrong views, because he did...but I also feel sorrow and compassion for him, because he did not know the joy of living, same to crowley, and other poor souls who suffer from desire and hatred in this world. Compassion preached in buddhism arises from recognizing that others suffer like we do also, whats the point of saving someones life if they will live it the same way they did before trapped in the world of greed and other negative emotions? In buddhism we try to help people so that theyw ill escape the cycle of greed and hate and realize the peace and joy that has always been there...and has always been available. One moment of truth is eternity in heaven.
Red is red and blue is blue, you seem to have them confused, wrong is wrong and right is right, not judging, just simple truth.
If you wish to get to a destination, you take a car, a plane or just walk but what matters is that you get to the destination right? That's why buddhism is just a tool, a tool or a vehicle to reach enlightenment just as any other religions are.
My take on it too shall pass is that all is peace, and enlightenment is peace. Emptiness in all things, Buddha preached abotu atoms and emptioness of atoms over 2,000 years back. As you know, atoms are made up of mostly empty space, and everythign in this universe is made of it, so how come my hand doesn;t just go through my computer? Because there is different frequency that these atoms vbibrate at, thats all physical is. Our thoughts and emotions are waves too, and within our consciousness, when all settles, and we are free from desires, and impure thoughts that arised from attachment and "ego", we reach calmness and inner peace that is like a immovable rock. Quantom physics, when a wavelength vibrates at higher frequency, it has power to bring lower frequency waves to meet it, scientists have found general love and compassion to be highest frequency of all emotions...we cannot destroy hate with hate but only with love, common sense, and truth.
Think about it, who are we really? When we are born, are we born of hate, are we full of greed, are we born to be evil? No, we are born with innocence, even bible contains very good truth, Jesus said in matthews that if we are not like children, we will nto enter kingdom of heaven. A mind free from attachment is liek a mirror that reflects all, and glows in radiance, it is like a midset of innocent child. There's nothing special or extra ordinary to enlightenemnt, it is neither hard or easy, its just what it is. When you see a rock what do you see, a rock right? That is enlgithenent. To see things without worldly perspective. It must be experienced to be known to the fullest.
peace
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Post by Marquis on Feb 15, 2004 1:44:25 GMT
and yes it is a matter of choice, how will you feel if someone judged you stupid for not knowing somethign thats common sense to them? Same thing here. If people do not know, you teach them, and if you do not know, you learn.
If there was only one way of doing things, one way to think, one way to see things, there woudl onyl need to be one person. We are diverse, which makes it easy to see and expereince others beliefs. I think why I love buddhism so much is because of its openness, I have been to a lot of buddhist temples in korea and I felt so much peace and serenity whenever I was there. Hard part was realizing that peace and serenity can also be found in my own daily life.
peace
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Post by Marquis on Feb 15, 2004 4:21:57 GMT
And you've just put a label, or even two, lables you said you don't put on people. You did that like a true catholic... And the cycle continues. peace |
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Post by Sniper on Feb 15, 2004 5:32:58 GMT
You heard the bell ringing somewhere in the distance but you don't know where and therefore you go and get lost even more... I should not say this, but indeed I a person who claimed to know a way is now getting lost in a forest and that makes me feel nice and remember one greek myth...
Wrong views? Do you feel you can draw a line between right views and wrong views? You said you got rid of lines, then why did you just draw another one saying Hitler had wrong views?..
Hitler had a different views than you or I or the pope, but that doesn't make us superior before him and that doesn't give us the right to judge him. We can express our opinion like "to me he did was a bad guy" but without to me, to my mind, in my opinion, etc. we will become judges and put ourselves above those we judge and thus think we are better, is that right in your opinion?
Indeed. Or is it just what you can see? I see people far away, they are so small, they seem to be as small as flies, but are they?
People hate and people are mortal, thus those who hate can die, in other words they can be eliminated, that is a way of eliminating hate too. It is even more simple.
If a horse doesn't drink water, can you make it drink?
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Post by Marquis on Feb 15, 2004 13:58:44 GMT
Sky is blue, his views were wrong. Sniper, why do you say that a rabbit dances int he sky? (  Vir) Didn't you say soul or consiouness is eternal? Hate and murder will continue in their next life as it will be their karma and yin yang. Action/reaction, simple thing, its like saying adding more fuel to fire will stop the current fire. You cannot get rid of one element with another, only water can put out fire. To me, people are buddhas, all of them, with unlimited potential, an atom that is changed just a little here will chnage an atom far away whether its surrounded by a wall or not...regladless of space, and time. We change the world everyday, we have potential to be any thing we wish to be, afterall all anything is, is just different frequency of atoms that manifest as an physical object. When the waves of unneccessary thoughts and emotions based on attachments just stop...even for a sec, we can live in total awareness. That is the core of meditation, the mindfulness of everyday living. Nirvana is total awareness, when you are most awake. Be aware of your feelings and thoughts, and find the source of it. You will find what is right and what is wrong. peace |
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Post by Marquis on Feb 15, 2004 14:09:25 GMT
If the damn horse doesn't drink the water, you try to feed him, but if he doesn't drink, the motherfuckers on his own...lol jk
But the most important thing about this is that thats a horse, not a human being. We are consious and we can choose to be rebellious like in teenage years, however if we are brought up with compassion and love of our parents we woudl turn out quite fine. Of course sometimes their love is strict, like our parents woudl stop us from crossing the road when cars are going by, should they let us just go across because they respect our views or choice? However that is if and when, it is not NOW, you are focusing too much on circumstances that is not now...live in now...thats the only way to live anyway. Now do you think it is right to kill naother being, do you feel you can just pull a trigger and shoot down your brother or sister etc? now? If not, it is a wrong view...and this is true for everyone...there is right and wrong. Which is right and which is wrong, that is decided by individuals, but deep don inside everyioen arleady knwos. To fight agaisnt it, is fighting against inevitabel otherwise laws of nature. As you change in the inside, you change outside, all these circumstances may never happen.
peace
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Post by Sniper on Feb 15, 2004 20:55:17 GMT
Nice said, but let us go back to earth. What is hate? Huh? A feeling. Who feel? Live humans do. If you kill humans who hate, all their friends, relatives, etc. so no one will be willing to avenge their deaths, will they continue hating? No, because the dead don't hate. If you compare hate with fire, gasoline will be bad emotions causing the fire to burn, and thus a hating person is a burning object. With love/compassion/water you eliminate the fire/hate, but if you eliminate the object, burry it, as sand puts out fire even better. Using water you preserve the burning object, using sand you burry it. In both cases the fire is stopped.
His views were different, you are judging a person right now. What gives you the right to say someone has right/wrong point of view?
I wish I knew what my posts have in common with rabits in the sky.
You did not get the point of that proverb. Ok, I'll try to explain it: you enter a burning building because you want to save a person there, you see the person, shout "this way, I'll take you out of here" and the person tells you "no, I want to stay here" - you can show a way out, but you can't make the person to leave the building. The choice is the most important thing.
Death doesn't last forever, as life it is a temporary state.
To fight against what? Laws of nature concear only our bodies, we establish our own way, we choose our destiny, we choose what is right and wrong for us, we fight nothing, we live a life we want.
They do so because they are parents and parents care about their children. Even if you choose to go across and die they'll do everything to prevent that. They will allow only choices they like.
Rebelling is fighting against something that is superior and tries to enslave you. Teenagers aren't rebelious, they think they are, but they aren't. Teenagers are starting to see the world with their own eyes, they begin to establish their own opinions, that is not rebelling, that is growing up. They think they are adults already, but they are still kids, they talk too much.
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Post by Marquis on Feb 16, 2004 0:30:47 GMT
ok, energy never dies but changes shapes..even u agreed that soul exist, so if you are born again in different body but with energy thats carried over from yoru past life, the murderous intent and etc...it continues. hate is never ceased by hatred but by love, and this by law that has existed forever. Your view about gettign rid of hate by killing that person who harbors hate is wrong and detrimental to both self and others. For example, U.S is fightign a war in Afghanistan, what do you thinkt he children of those dead terrorists are going to grow up to become? Ok, terrorists hate U.S and we kiled them, won;t their chldren hate us too? Oh, yea lets kill them too, wait now whole international community hate us fro starting unneccessary wars, lets kill them too. Parents of our deceased soldiers hate our govt, so kill them too. Nothing is solved, hate only bears more hate. Do nto try to stop sun from rising. I am a judge of no one, I judge actions. actions and views whats the difference, a view leads to the action. An intent to kill starts with a thought, a wrong view will incite actions of hate and other negative emotions, I try to keep the midnset of only do not know, the beginners mind, I kinda stayed away from that mindset in couple of my posts in which I might have assumed some things, I'm sorry I'm sure a satanist who murdered children is a very nice person lol jk everyone has potential to be buddha as I said. Farther you are away from the source, more suffering is endured. closer you get to the source, peace becaomes clear, inner peace cannot be gained by killing someone, or helpign someone, it is gained by knowing that it is arleady there, otherwise it would nto be an inner peace just a satisfaction at accomplishign something that will go away soon. However when it is reached, because it is arleady with all of us, you volunteerly help another...for he/she knows what its like to be chasing after impermaneant objects to fill their inner peace and would want to help others attain it also. A monk saved a scorpion drowing in a river, it stung him, scorpion fell in th eriver again and the monk once again saved it, and the scopion stung him again. The fellow monk said, why do you keep savin it when it hurt you? The monk said because it is my nature to do so. Of course, we choose our own destiny, I said we change the world everyday, however there are some things immovable like what you would define as soul, I call it our true mind at its purest form, when in this state, we arleady know what is right and what is wrong withotu labeling it or without hearing it from another, and this is state of enlightenment. Your story is similar to a rabbit dancing in the sky, rabbit doesn't dance in the sky, it is unnatural, and almost never occurs unless a plane is flying by with rabbit in a cage inside it, and its dancing..lol. When's the last time you have been in a building thats about to collapse and you ahd to save that person? Oh, we might have been in circumstances where we believed we knew what was the right thing for another person in certain situation, but most of the times, it is what we "belive" to be the right thing for another at that time...not neccessary what is right or neccessary. A parent preventing his/her child from crossing the street when its full of cars is example of when it is neccessary...when danger is clear and it is neccessary to stop a being by force to save their life. However questions liek will you forcibly make someone live is pointless. If someone is intent on killing themselves, they are trying to do so because there is obiously a problem, and it shoudl be taken as a sign that they need help. One of my fav zen story is when you throw stick a dog would chase after the stick, but a lionw ould go after the person who threw the stick. like a lion, if we look at the source of the problem, we can find the answer thats more concrete and productive or answer that leads to a solution.  i believe I have answered everything, I find myself repeating same things. Further discussion is pointless, for we both expressed our views arleady and I think we understood each others point of view. peace |
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Post by Angel One on Feb 17, 2004 21:16:09 GMT
Good point With greater intelligence comes greater pain, but also the prospect for greater happiness. A sheep can never experience things like love, or joy. Its a trade-off. Yes, thats very similiar to one of my favourite stories too. But the thing is, people can change their nature. Through willpower, or through some kind of traumatic event, people can change who they are. |
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Post by Angel One on Feb 17, 2004 21:21:50 GMT
Well said, very mature of you. |
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Post by davidremember on Feb 17, 2004 22:09:39 GMT
k now I am 100% sure thta this is a religious site
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Post by davidremember on Feb 17, 2004 22:19:08 GMT
I bet u shawled the lexis,terminology,vocabulary,terms,and text from a manuscript,document, or a book.
You banaled that text from a site!
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Post by Angel One on Feb 17, 2004 22:35:18 GMT
This is not a religious site, I just like that picture! Ill remove it for a more impartial one if youd prefer, it was never intended to cause such a misunderstanding.
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Post by DAVIDREMEMBER on Feb 17, 2004 23:28:42 GMT
to person that started thread: you dont threaten me with your BIg vocabulary. I challenge you to a vocabulary Competition. We all know that you think that your better than I. We all know that I is better than YYYYYoooooouuuuuuuu
O and that thread was 100% religious mumbo-jumbo
I stoped reading it after the I saw the word "Bless"
Now excuse me but I have to take over the Boards.
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Vir)
